@cj pretty reasonable.
@cj I dislike how you label everyone you argue against as "extremists" and (it feels ickily intentional on your part) "purists".
People can be against nazis and at the same time feel strongly about not closing _their own_ software to them, and also be annoyed when others do it and still want to tout they are doing "free software".
Maybe you address this in your post, but I only got about three paragraphs in before it got me aggravated.
@mariusor Thanks for the candid feedback -- I didn't address it, and I didn't have a better term.
I know you don't fall into the buckets I describe and people I've been arguing against -- I've seen some vitrolic garbage the past few weeks, and I know you're definitely nowhere near that.
Clearly though, my language/communication needs improvement. Do you have an idea on better language, writing approaches?
I'll be thinking and editing over the next hour or so.
> Do you have an idea on better language, writing approaches?
Don't use labels that equate the people you argue against with the actual nazis. Give them the benefit of the doubt. The "technological purity" is actually "principial idealism" or "naivete" if you are really convinced they are wrong. :)
@mariusor OK, I changed "technological purity" to "technological idealism", is that better?
I realize my opening paragraph describing gab is meant to discuss the kind of users using gab, but it is not meant to bucket the reader. I'll look at clarifying that next.
@mariusor OK, first two paragraphs are updated. Hopefully I sound less ranty, but I still probably sound just as exhausted.
@mariusor Finally, there shouldn't be references to 'free speech extremist' anymore but "naive free-speecher", but I do point out how it tends towards extremism.
I would agree with you in the case where we make the distinction between "tusky" the project and "tusky" the android application. They can have limits to *their application which are distinct from the underlying code.
@mariusor See, you're way more nuanced and moderate! You're already setting the bar of discussion way higher than this blog post.
Also I welcome a different way of thinking about the "bug vs feature" argument than the "just tech" vs "tech + humanity" viewpoint I laid out, I'm still not sure if the word "tech purity" or its concept you found aggravating.
@lanodan Do golang templates not default to utf-8 encoding? I'm about to flip a table in frustration...
@lanodan Yes, I'll fix that. Independent of that, the code is supposed to be doing stuff in UTF-8 anyway. Since your browser assumes that and still sees broken artifacts, uh oh!
@lanodan Gah. OK. "Content-Type" HTTP responses will soon be "text/html; charset=utf-8" as it should be.
I have a hunch this markdown processor I am using is one piece of the problem.
@lanodan Just as I feared, I fixed the UTF-8 issue and now I also get to see all these awesome <?> with you.
@lanodan It's friggin smart quotes and smart apostrophes.
@fedilab you should read this.
@cj "But I think limiting features of an application strictly to the technology loses sight of why we have technology in the first place. It isn’t to ultimately, at the top of the chain, serve other technology. It is there to serve humanity."
Damn good words.
@erosdiscordia Thanks! Unfortunately, when the robots take over I'll be the first one to go.
Hi, please note that one can (mostly) agree with all you have (very well) written there, *and* be viscerally against nazi ideology and speech, *and* still disagree with blocking them that way at the client application level.
@RLetot Well yeah. Like I said in the conclusion, last line: I just hope you have a better argument for your third belief than one of the 5 I refuted.
@cj thanks for the roundup!
@cj I think that rickrolling is suboptimal compared to an error message.
a) It is not impossible that unknowing people will be mislead into signing up on Gab, and there have been cases of people signing up on Gab to spy on the extremists. So you might annoy the wrong people.
b) A rickroll does not communicate that something is wrong with Gab or hateful ideologies. It is a non-educational message. If you play a ContraPoints video it'll do more good.
@Gargron I think "You might annoy the wrong people" argument is super weak. The majority of people signing into Gab aren't spies, they're actual extremists. And I personally don't think there is a moral obligation to treat them and their genocidal views seriously.
I think Tusky is looking to redirect to a de-radicalization website/organization instead of the temporary rickroll, though. I don't know much, maybe @maloki can elaborate more.
@maloki Hi! Is the long term plan to keep the rickroll or to redirect to a de-radicalization site? I seem to remember an idea about the latter. Which website / organization was being considered? I think it'd be a really cool partnership opportunity for both the Tusky project and a nonprofit.
@Gargron +1 for playing a contrapoints video to anyone trying to sign into gab.
This Mastodon instance is for people interested in technology. Discussions aren't limited to technology, because tech folks shouldn't be limited to technology either!